G lens conversions

[digitalintrigue]

Does anyone have any experience with Contax G lens conversions to Leica M?

Here is the translated Japanese webpage.
(http://66.102.9.104/translate_c?hl=en&sl=ja&u=http://www.hayatacamera.co.jp/services/miyazaki/index.html&prev=/search%3Fq%3Dhttp://www.hayatacamera.co.jp/index.html)

Contax G 21/2.8 Biogon converted to M:
http://www.hayatacamera.co.jp/images/services/miyazaki/2007/image0001.jpg

[Brian]

Not me! I've been asked about it before. The adapter shown looks like a custom made parts in an LTM->M adapter.

[digitalintrigue]

Possibly the favorite lens I've ever owned was the 45/2 Planar for the G; they can be found in perfect shape for not a lot. I'm wondering if it would be worth converting to M mount. The 50/2 Planar ZM would be a lot easier, of course...need to find some comparisons of the two...

[Brian]

You'll need a precision cut cam to accommodate the 45mm focal length. I'm thinking you can run $1000 for a conversion like that.

[digitalintrigue]

They charge 50,400 yen for a 45/2 conversion (see link)

[Brian]

That's not bad considering the custom machining! Those are some really cool conversions. Maybe when I retire, I'll buy a surplus CNC machine...

[digitalintrigue]

You are right, it is not bad at all.

After looking at used G lens pricing, a couple of them seem to be reasonable even after adding $500 worth of conversion. The 21 is unfortunately not one of them, best just to buy the 21/4.5 or 2.8 Biogon.

[raid]

It would be maybe worth it if the G1/G2 cameras are retired forever and someone has many lenses.

[jmkelly]

The only reference I have seen to Miyazaki's work is the MS MODE-S 50mm/f1.3 Sonnar, which comes in Nikon mount with a M-mount adapter. Over at RFF "jonmanjiro" compared it with the Millemmium Nikkor; I think "hacker" owns one. IMHO the MODE-S did not measure up all that well, but I would not have blamed it on the mounting work.

Check this link (http://translate.google.com/translate?sourceid=navclient&hl=en&u=http%3a%2f%2fwww2%2emitte%2enir%2ejp%2f%7em%2dka m%2f) to see some of the other lenses MS has done.

[digitalintrigue]

John, Raid:

After starting this thread a couple of weeks ago, I discovered that Miyazaki now has a rep (Japan Exposures, http://www.japanexposures.com) who will soon be taking orders for preconverted Contax G lenses, and will even have a lens available for demo.

[jmkelly]

Robert:

Japan Exposures is the reincarnation of Dirk Rosler's Megaperls shop. He has been selling some Miyazaki stuff for a long time - my eyepiece adapter for the Hexar RF and the 1.3x magnifier I use on my Ikon (and R-D1) came from there.

Dirk is a great guy to deal with. I wonder if he would be willing to intermediate with Miyazaki-san if one were to send him a lens for conversion?

[digitalintrigue]

John, yes, it's formerly Megaperls.

He's not only selling pre-converted lenses, but I'm sure if you already have a lens he can convert it for you.

[raid]

However, the $550 average cost is not low. It may be worthwhile for one special lens to collect and treasure. It is more about collecting than getting a deal for a lens that will be used. This is my feeling.

[raid]

Amedeo is looking into such converisons. He already has converted a Zeiss Planar 50mm 1.8 from Rollei QBM mount into M mount with full RF coupling. The 501.8 sells right now at ebay for $50 in QBM, so it is a question how much is it really worth to convert such a lens to M mount.

[digitalintrigue]

It is a good value to me, as the only alternative are ZM lenses which cost more, and the Contax G lenses are highly praised.

I have seen Amedeo's conversion of the Planar, but that is an SLR lens and much bigger. If he were to do Contax G conversions, it would involve shipping lenses to Venezuela, I doubt very much he will sell lenses already converted. Amedeo certainly does good work, he is making a Nikon/Contax RF adapter for me (using a Nikon S2 helical) so I can use a couple of vintage Sonnars I picked up. He previously made one for me about a year ago, but he had not perfected focus except for 50mm, now he has them working with longer focal lengths.

In any case, I'm looking forward to trying the 45/2 Contax G Planar!

[jmkelly]

Raid - good point on the "true" worth of such a conversion. At least to Rollei users. :) Cynically I might note that there is a sucker born every second, er, I mean... never underestimate what some will be willing to pay to create an M-mount lens. ;)

But seriously, some lenses are easier to convert than others. Victor Chan's M-mount conversions of the Canon 55/1.2 FD and FL sell at auction for $400-$500, which puts the value of the mount somewhere around $250-$300. This was about the same as what his conversion of the Canon 50/0.95 was "worth" when I bought one from him back in the days before this lens was re-popularized, or should I say Nocti-fied.

I suspect that clearing a G Planar of its cladding and autofocus machinery is non-trivial and labor-intensive. And then crafting a mount for RF requires more care and machining precision than building an SLR mount.

And Robert's point that a new ZM Planar at $700 is more expensive than a G planar conversion is moot (actually I expect that the comparative cost is a push). There is just an undeniable "cool" factor to the converted lens.

[JapanExposures]

Hello everybody,

Dirk here from JE, formerly Megaperls. Appreciate the links and mentions.

Yes, we are working on ramping up the offering on services of MS Optical. You can send us your existing G lens or we can supply a finished package... more info soon.

The conversions do not simply involve changing the mount alone. Among other things, a helicoid is attached to enable manual focus.

MS-MODE was not meant to be an ultra sharp lens. Actually at the time you were able to specify the level of sharpness you wanted and MS would then fine tune it for your individual taste, which I thought is pretty cool.

Anyway, my first post here so I better look for some of my CZ images to upload into the gallery.

All the best to the new forum too.

Regards

Dirk

[raid]

Dirk,

Thanks for your clarifications. Still, the cost is a major factor to many people owning a G1/G2 system who would consider having lenses modified to LTM. Is there a quantity discount?
1 lens for $550
2 lenses for $450/lens
3 lenses for $350/lens?

[JapanExposures]

Raid, in short, no there is no quantity discount (and the scheme you suggest is quite ambitious). MS is pretty busy as it is with their domestic activity so we are not really in a position to argue for lower prices. Also since the conversion is more of a service than a physical product, I find quantity discounts for services always a little difficult to justify. The exchange rate is not helping of course. Having said that, we can of course talk about other value add like free shipping etc.

[raid]

Dirk,
I understand your views. Free shipping is also a nice gesture. My suggested numbers were just numbers.

[jmkelly]

Dirk, welcome to the forum and congratulations on the japanexposures site - very interesting and readable. Thanks for the email announcement of the site change, too - makes a case study in good customer service.

That is very interesitng (and cool) that the MS-MODE was offered with customizable sharpness - that element was lost in the discussions of the lens I have seen. Was the concept similar to the recalibration for optimal focus Zeiss offers on the ZM Sonnar C?

I will be very interested in seeing how the converted 45mm/2 Planar compares to the Konica KM 50/2 Hexanon!

My interest might be greater in a conversion of the 90mm G Sonnar. In theory the converted lens would be more compact and lighter than a comparable Leica product (and about half the price), or the new Zeiss ZM lenses as well.

Will the converted lenses maintain the close-focus distances and light gathering of the originals?

[Brian]

Welcome aboard, Dirk!

What a neat -and unique- Service. It's nice to see these "orphaned" lenses finding new life because of shops like yours.

Looking forward to seeing pictures of the lenses, and those made with the lenses. I'm guessing the folks here and on rangefinderforum.com will be a ready made market for these products.

[raid]

Yes, it is a great service. I appreciate such workmanship at times when digital photography is being pushed forward.

[raid]

An advantage that we sometimes forget about is the fact that with a RF camera, slower shutter speeds can be used for added sharpness as compared to hand holding an SLR camera. In this respect, the converted SLR lens has added value for photography. As for the G1/G2 lenses, not everyone is stomaching the G system.

[JapanExposures]

Thanks for the warm welcome, all. I have been shooting large format almost exclusively for the last 1-2 years (apart from some digital with Canon DSLR and Ricoh GRD, they have all been sold now as I found them distracting me - YMMV) and it is nice for to get into RF again a little.

Appreciate the compliments on our site. We are getting a lot of positive attention, from the audience but also photographers and galleries in Japan. That's how we wanted it.

I am not familiar how the calibration of the Sonnar was done. I just remember comments that it was not as sharp as the Planar (and it would be foolish to expect otherwise), and also a Summilux it ain't. I have never asked MS how exactly they adjust the sharpness, I assume by controlling the amount of aberration resulting in sharper or less sharper image. Anyway, I like that concept because in the age of digital (no offense intended), sharpness is really overrated. One could say "a bourgeois concept" :)

I will be shooting the 45 alongside the Hex 50 and the ZM 50 - should be fun.

A converted Sonnar 90 should arrive later this week. I have no Leica counterpart to compare it to, although perhaps I should sneak into the Tokyo Leica Store and secretly compare it. This lens should be a real stunner and I am looking forward to it. I have never used a lens longer than 50 on RF actually.

I will confirm with MS in the next few days if and to what extent the original characteristics will be maintained. Close focus distance should depend on the helicoid. By light gathering you mean max/widest aperture? I cannot imagine that being different from the original as the original aperture will remain, albeit with a new ring.

It may not be a bargain to do this, but it is yet another step to maintain lens diversity on RF cameras and that can only be a good thing. As someone else has said, "I don't do photography to save money, I save money for my photography".

All the best

Dirk

[Ben Marks]

I have one converted 45 G lens, which I did with Mr. Miyazaki. The conversion is useful and I use the lens on my M8; the aperture is smooth though, no click stops. I have just sent a 28 G- Biogon off to Dirk at Japan Exposures (formerly Megapearls??). Payment was in advance via paypal; it promises to be a smoother process than my last lens conversion, for which I had to find my own "correspondent" in Japan. Hayata Camera Labs doesn't ship overseas. I'd be happy to report on the results, if folks are interested. Some of the items on the Japan Exposures website look very interesting (e.g. eyepiece magnifiers). Good luck to Dirk and to Japan Exposures in this new endeavor.

Ben Marks

[JapanExposures]

Hi all,

here are some shots of the 28/2.8 on a Hexar RF:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/megaperls/tags/glensconversion/

The hood is an MS Optical "smart" slit hood which has filter threads all over the place.

Ben, thanks, received your 28 this morning...

Regards

Dirk

[digitalintrigue]

The lens has a very unique 'vintage modern' look. :) Very cool!

[raid]

I would like to have a lens comparison done between converted G1 lenses with matching ZM lenses.

[Ben Marks]

I would like to have a lens comparison done between converted G1 lenses with matching ZM lenses.

Raid:

I have been searching for the perfect 28 for a while now.

I am happy to make some pix with the following on an M8:

Converted 28/2.8 G-Biogon
28/2.8 Elmarit (pre-asph)
Cosina 28/1.9
Cosina 28/2

I have thought about a 29/2.8 Hexanon and the 28/2.8 ZM . . . my hope is that the Biogon will make any further acquisitions unnecessary.

May take a couple of weeks though -- I likely will be traveling when the converted G-Biogon returns from Japan.

Ben Marks

[JapanExposures]

I am wondering how much a comparison with a cropped frame format will reveal. After all the best in life always happens on the edges, doesn't it? :D Wouldn't you just be looking at the sweet spots of each of these lenses..?

[Ben Marks]

I am wondering how much a comparison with a cropped frame format will reveal. After all the best in life always happens on the edges, doesn't it? :D Wouldn't you just be looking at the sweet spots of each of these lenses..?

Well, true. But each of these lenses would be on the same M8, so at least you'd be able to compare "sweet-spots.";) My interest is in finding a lens that performs well across the frame as well as across its aperture range.

I find the 28/1.9 Ultron to be fairly low-contrast wide open.
I find that the 28/2 Ultron to focus shift at f:2.8-5.6. You can learn to compensate, but it is sort of a pain if you are constantly switching lenses.
I like, but do not love the Elmarit.

So there are my biases. A side-by-side comparison could also show you how out-of-focus areas and transitional areas are rendered . . .

Ben

[Stephen]

Dirk, welcome to the forum and congratulations on the japanexposures site - very interesting and readable. Thanks for the email announcement of the site change, too - makes a case study in good customer service.

That is very interesitng (and cool) that the MS-MODE was offered with customizable sharpness - that element was lost in the discussions of the lens I have seen. Was the concept similar to the recalibration for optimal focus Zeiss offers on the ZM Sonnar C?




Dirk responses well to emails! He is helping me convert a black Sonnar 90mm. I hope to see the results soon. The 45 will be next if all goes well.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3127/3232661107_7fb2db9b81_o.jpg

I'm glad Dirk has decided to bridge the link between the Japanese market and the rest of the world. In fact, I did not know about the MS Optical MS Mode f/1.3 being able to be customized as far as sharpness is concerned. I own two actually, with the last in the series sent to me late last year.

Stephen (aka Hacker)

[digitalintrigue]

Stephen, that black Sonnar conversion will look great. :)

[Brian]

I'd like to know how they do the sharpness trick. I ended up with a "less-sharp/smoother Bokeh" J-3. 1958 lens with a 1974 front element. Looks undercorrected for spherical aberration. I made (and sold) a 1959 J-3 with a 1986 front element that came out the reverse- Very Sharp, cool-but harsher-Bokeh.

Wide-Open:
http://flickr.com/photos/oldcamerapictures/3221979228/

Stopped down a little:
http://flickr.com/photos/oldcamerapictures/3221979230/

The 1959 lens with 1986 front element, wide-open:
http://flickr.com/photos/oldcamerapictures/1605347125/in/set-72157602481458663/

The other neat thing about this J-3- the focal length is ever so slightly reduced. Originally, the 1958 lens needed about a 0.1mm shim added. The "new formulation" was spot-on without the correction.

ANYWAY: it is now an S-Mount lens. Because there are NO soft focus Nikkor lenses...

[Stephen]

Stephen, that black Sonnar conversion will look great. :)

I should compare it against the ZM 85mm. Now waiting for the M3 so as not to have any crop areas :burnout:.

[raid]

Stephen,
Let us know how the comparison will turn out. I am very interested in G1 lenses for M use.

[Stephen]

Stephen,
Let us know how the comparison will turn out. I am very interested in G1 lenses for M use.

For me, the two to get are the 45mm and the 90mm. They are very stellar performers. The rest have many viable alternatives or modern updates, e.g. ZM 21mm f/2.8 and the f/4.5 and the ZM 28mm.

The 16mm Hologon is very interesting, but it is not RF coupled.

[digitalintrigue]

What's in the box? [click the photo]

http://theonlinephotographer.typepad.com/.a/6a00df351e888f883401116839bf8c970c-800wi (http://theonlinephotographer.typepad.com/the_online_photographer/2009/02/lil-bastard.html)

[raid]

A modfied lens maybe?
Show us the lens.

[raid]

For me, the two to get are the 45mm and the 90mm. They are very stellar performers. The rest have many viable alternatives or modern updates, e.g. ZM 21mm f/2.8 and the f/4.5 and the ZM 28mm.

The 16mm Hologon is very interesting, but it is not RF coupled.

Well, I am in the process of acquiring/getting the 28-45-90 set with a green label G1, so eventually having the 45 and 90 is great. The 28 is no slouch, I hear.

[Stephen]

The lens has not disappointed from my initial tests.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3486/3277797537_781a2c4826_o.jpg

[Stephen]

Samples:

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3367/3281295248_a2a2d4605b_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3079/3281295428_9032394df7_o.jpg

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3382/3280474783_2150e719d6_o.jpg

[Brian]

Those are wonderful! Talk about smooth Bokeh!

I need to use my 90/2.8 Tele-Elmarit, and post some shots with it. I think the Sonnar Bokeh wins again!

[raid]

Stephen,
The photos have great looking bokeh and sharpness too.

I find the black on black good looking ... the lens on the M8. My lens is silver.

[digitalintrigue]

Those shots would be very difficult on an original Contax G1/G2 as the focus was hit or miss. Very nice. :) Can't wait to see some 45/2 Planar results, I believe Dirk is doing some comparison photos...

[JapanExposures]

Indeed, I am working on a comparison of Hexanon 50, ZM 50 and Planar 45, but due to the lack of Leica M8 (donations welcome :) I have to scan the film now. On the upside, it will be "full frame" ;)

These shots of the 90 are very attractive, I am impressed about the in-focus/out-of-focus areas ("dementia") and the transition. Well done.

[raid]

The M8 images are very life like; maybe too much.

[JapanExposures]

I have shot the G Planar along with the ZM Planar and the Hexanon 50. Results here:

http://www.japanexposures.com/lenscomparison/index.html

See what you think about it...

I can supply the full size files to those who want to dig deeper.

[Romeo]

Wow.

Why are they not available for others outside of Japan as LTM mounts? The M mount already has a huge variety of available modern optics.

There's a huge collectors' drive to rack up the prices for sharp LTM lenses. A Biogon 35mm f2 or 45 Planar on an old LTM camera surely makes commercial sense?!

I can only imagine how fantastic it must make a LTM screw camera user to have one or two of these Zeiss-G lens conversions :)

[JapanExposures]

Why are they not available for others outside of Japan as LTM mounts? The M mount already has a huge variety of available modern optics.

The reason is that in some cases the camera may be required for fine adjustment (the same goes for the RD-1 BTW). If anyone wishes to send their camera along or don't mind the risk of RF focussing inaccuracy, they are of course welcome. In that case the conversion cost is a little lower as no L->M ring is required.

Regards

Dirk

[raid]

At f 2.0 and 1/2000 I can see more details in the shade (the fans?) for the G lens than in the ZM lens.

[raid]

The images of the dangling chain taken at f 2.0 again show the G lens to be sharper than the ZM.

[JapanExposures]

The G lens seems to have the edge over the ZM in several respects, and the Hexanon lags. Vignetting at f2 seems obvious with the Hexanon. The dangling chain has even some glow around it with the Hexanon, whereas with the G it is very sharp.

More shots here:

http://www.flickr.com/photos/megaperls/tags/contaxgplanar45/

I am impressed with the G Planar, and feel a bit disappointed about the ZM.

[raid]

I wish I could get as a loaner a ZM lens!

[JapanExposures]

I wish I could get as a loaner a ZM lens!

Wanna buy mine? ;)

[raid]

Why don't you loan it to me first, and then we will see? :D

[raid]

I did a lens comparison on the two G1/G2 lenses, andI mailed out the lens to the next user. The Planar 45mm 2.0 is stunning.

[F.Rokkor]

My Biogon 21/2,8 has arrived, straight from JapanExposures :rock:

http://flor27.free.fr/Carl_Zeiss_G-Biogon_21_2.8_LM_conversion/content/bin/images/large/IMG_0253.jpg

More pics here : http://flor27.free.fr/Carl_Zeiss_G-Biogon_21_2.8_LM_conversion/

[digitalintrigue]

Nice. :) What finder are you going to use?

A 45/2 and a 28/2.8 arrived at my door today.

[F.Rokkor]

The finder is the original Contax G 21mm provided along the converted lens. I don't have any other so I will keep using this one :)

[digitalintrigue]

Very good, did you supply the lens, or did Japan Exposures provide it?

[F.Rokkor]

Very good, did you supply the lens, or did Japan Exposures provide it?
They did.

[Jaap]

Those shots would be very difficult on an original Contax G1/G2 as the focus was hit or miss. Very nice. :) Can't wait to see some 45/2 Planar results, I believe Dirk is doing some comparison photos...

Oh yes ?
after more then 13 years with a G2 this is news for me !!!!

[digitalintrigue]

The 90 was always a bit iffy for me...but not the other lenses. Although I have to admit more accurate than manual focusing a Leica. :)

[raid]

With the possibility of having adapters for the G1/G2 lenses, the Japanexposures conversions should die off.

[digitalintrigue]

That's not an easy thing to engineer, the flange distance of the Contax is 29mm, and the Leica is 28.95mm. The leaves only 1.05mm of room for a flange adapter, plus there must be some solution for focus.

[Ranana_Envery]

you can see all the pages a visitor looks at when browsing the visitors and clicking the look for the last page and thats the last page they browsed, is that what you mean?

[Ranana_Envery]

rnI just bought a lens adapter so I could use my lenses from my Nikon on my E-500. And I was just wondering. Will it still be a 2:1 ratio or does the width of the adapter change that any?
rn
rnMike D.rn

[Ranana_Envery]

hi Guys.

i am using your software for tracking. and it is realy cool software.

i am interesting about last pages of visitors. i need to know from what page visitor leave my site.

is there some way for tracking or may be you can help me to constract direct query to DB.

thank you

[raid]

There is no functioning adapter available for the G1/G2 lenses, so japanexposures may be the best way togo.

[koji]

Hello guys first time, MS-Optical has been working those G-lens conversions more than five years I remember.
Mr. Miyazaki does many odd conversion too, ask him for anything. See this site, many of those old lenses
were converted by Mr. Miyazaki > http://www.oldlens.com/

The last time I ask the conversion, that have done over 300. Some of samples are in here too.
See the bottom line for two converted G-lenses 21 and 45 mm >
http://www.pbase.com/kkawakami/mylens_g_lenses

By the way MS_Optical normally returns every thing with each lens' testing result including many charts,
but that is in japanese unfortunately for many of you. I am not sure japanexposure conveys this paper to you
who asked lens conversion(s).

I did not upload the photos to this post, since the colour of uploaded photos are not so good comparing what I see
the same photo on many BSS sites and my Pbase account. Pity. (When I uploaded my Hologon photos, I found it.)

G-planar 45/2 is not my lens.

One possibly only one guy in China is working for G->M adapter, though it must be very difficult
since M mount flange distance is 27.80 mm whereas G's is 29 mm. So I have never heard the result yet.

[wilson.c]

Here's a link to a nice bit of conversion for the Contax-G 90 Sonnar to EOS. It's in Chinese though, but I think the photos say it all.

www.bootek.com/cgi-bin/ut/topic_show.cgi?id=2160&pg=1&bpg=1

It uses the original Contax-G helicoid for EOS conversion, but this not as flexible as Koji's solution to M42.

Now to find a low cost G90 for me to convert :-) I just lost one on evilBay last night @ $122.5 :-(

[robgrune]

I am thinking seriously to develop a digital back for the Contax G2. Using either the Kodak or Foveon imagers. The back would be functionally limited to capturing photos only: likely no viewing monitor, maybe only 200 ISO, no video, preconfigured for just about everything - a digital film only. But, it would capture excellent images. Would it sell? How many people would buy? Readership input/feedback is very appreciated. Thank you.